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Anime Jason
Owner
Location: Here Member Since: Sun Sep 12, 2004 Posts: 2,834
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Subject: Why the site's been flaky the last few days... Posted Mon Sep 14, 2009 at 02:47:51 pm EDT (Viewed 459 times) |
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anime.mangacool.net
(10.0.255.1) using
Apple Safari 4.0.3 on MacOS X (0 points)
It's because Comicboards (which shares this server) has been under attack by the Internet. Apparently either a search engine went haywire, or we were on some kind of Denial of Service list, but something kept hammering CB with 10,000 identical requests per hour.
I took some measurements to try and prevent it, and they seem to be working so far. I'm keeping an eye on things in case.
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HH
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Subject: I imagine Kirk was unhappy about something else that's happened in the Spider-Man books. [Re: Anime Jason] Posted Tue Sep 15, 2009 at 03:33:24 am EDT (Viewed 5 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 on Windows 2000
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killer shrike
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Subject: That's probably a coincidence [Re: HH] Posted Tue Sep 15, 2009 at 05:59:26 am EDT (Viewed 5 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 8 4.0; on Windows Vista
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HH notes motive, method, and opportunity
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Subject: I'm not so sure. Statistically there's a pretty fair chance that Kirk is angry about Spidey. [Re: killer shrike] Posted Tue Sep 15, 2009 at 10:21:54 am EDT (Viewed 5 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 on Windows 2000
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killer shrike
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Subject: No bet there; my point was that the latest outrage probably has nothing to do with Comicboards' problems [Re: HH notes motive, method, and opportunity] Posted Tue Sep 15, 2009 at 06:04:13 pm EDT (Viewed 4 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 8 4.0; on Windows Vista
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CrazySugarFreakBoy!
Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2004 Posts: 1,235
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Subject: Maybe, and maybe not, but it's safe to say that I helped keep Marvel busy this weekend. [Re: killer shrike] Posted Wed Sep 16, 2009 at 12:20:32 am EDT (Viewed 571 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 7 4.0; on Windows Vista
The full story can be gleaned from the links:
Suffice it to say that Marvel's doing some damage control at the moment.
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CrazySugarFreakBoy!
Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2004 Posts: 1,235
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Subject: See my reply to shrike below. :) [Re: HH notes motive, method, and opportunity] Posted Wed Sep 16, 2009 at 12:22:26 am EDT (Viewed 346 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 7 4.0; on Windows Vista
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HH
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Subject: On this. [Re: CrazySugarFreakBoy!] Posted Wed Sep 16, 2009 at 05:43:09 am EDT (Viewed 10 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 on Windows 2000
Remarkably this is the first I've heard of this.
First off, the definition of rape: various dictionaries offer definitions which variously include or do not mention deception as condition which qualifies the act of sex as rape.
I'd cautiously go with the "it is" side of the argument based on very ancient narratives which depict Zeus or Uther Pendragon sleeping with women disguised as their husbands and which clearly depict the act as rape (although the Greeks tend to the "but then she enjoyed it so that's okay" qualifier).
That said I'm uncomfortable about how casually rape is used as a way of describing repugnant acts (rape of the environment, rape of the senses, rape of his rights etc), even sexual ones, because the danger is that actual, genuine, unquestioned rape then gets blurred with lots of other definitions. There's a spectrum of rough consentual sex, elective rape fantasy play, mutually drunken regret-it-tomorrow intercourse, paid for sex with economically helpless sex workers etc., some of which raises moral questions, but all of which blur the intense ahborrence that rape should elicit.
Then I'd point out that there are a couple of very major examples of comics rape-by-deception that haven't been cited so far in the debate I've seen.
In the first Squadron Supreme limited series by Gruenwald, the Supremor's Hyperion is replaced by the Squadron Sinister version for a couple of issues. While posing as his heroic counterpart he sleeps with Power Princess, who yields to him after a long period of unspoken mutual lust between her and hero-Hyperion. In fairness to Gruenwald he does deal with the issues this raises and uses it to fuel the eventual denouement of the two Hyperions problem.
In the same series Golden Archer uses a mind control device to convince his ex-girlfriend Lady Lark to come back to him and they renew their sexual relationships as a consequence. This is likewise depicted as rape.
But the earliest implication of this happening is actually in Fantastic Four, circa #177-179 (Thomas/Perez - from memory). The Counter-Earth Reed Richards was likewise transformed by cosmic rays but on his world Sue Storm died of radiation and he was changed into the strong, deformed Brute. In a multi-part storylne the Brute comes to Earth and teams with the Frightful Four. "Our" Reed is cast into the Negative Zone to die (again) and the Brute is restored to human form and takes his place in the FF. There he finds himself alongside "our" Sue, who is alive, beautiful, and believes she is married to him.
There's a scene where Sue leaves her bedroom in a semi-transparent Perez-negligee and walks off looking troubled, and a caption saying something to the effect of "She can't get rid of the feeling that the man she's just left is not her husband." This is never mentioned again when Reed gets back to save the day (helped by the Brute who is suddenly contrite and sacrifices himself).
But anyway, sex with shapechanged imposters is almost compulsory at Marvel these days. The challenge is to find a heroine who hasn't slept with a skrull recently.
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killer shrike
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Subject: Yes, you played your part perfectly [Re: CrazySugarFreakBoy!] Posted Wed Sep 16, 2009 at 06:27:00 am EDT (Viewed 5 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 8 4.0; on Windows Vista
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Anime Jason
Owner
Location: Here Member Since: Sun Sep 12, 2004 Posts: 2,834
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Subject: There really is only ONE rule... [Re: HH] Posted Wed Sep 16, 2009 at 09:45:36 am EDT (Viewed 486 times) |
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anime.mangacool.net
(10.0.255.1) using
Apple Safari 4.0.3 on MacOS X (0.17 points)
Really, as a writer the only question you should ask yourself when depicting a really twisted sexual relationship: Is it taking or sharing? If one partner is taking instead of sharing, I believe it's quite obviously rape.
That can create some grey area too, like when time travel is involved, and someone who's in love with the past someone else will try to re-ignite a relationship, or re-live one, and the other person doesn't know the truth, but those situations are so rare and so complicated it gives most writers a headache just thinking about it.
I see what I think he was trying to do here. He was trying to create a modern version of a Silver-Age looking scenario, where tricking women into relationships or marriage was common. But since women are believed to be more sophisticated in comics these days, he thought he had to go further to make it believable. That's where it failed both in its intention and in execution.
The ultimate irony, though, is that, in the context of Women In Refrigerators, this all took place in a kitchen.
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Visionary
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Subject: This is the first I've heard of this too. [Re: HH] Posted Wed Sep 16, 2009 at 12:42:42 pm EDT (Viewed 4 times) |
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Posted with Mozilla Firefox 3.0.14 on Windows XP
Some interesting points, and nice nods to former comics precedent... especially the point about the whole recent Skrull thing.
Mistaken identity sex (whether through intentional deception or honest misunderstanding) is an old storytelling trope that I doubt will disappear anytime soon... it's too titillating, injecting some taboo into the lives of characters who would never normally do that kind of thing.
It's definitely been used for comedy in the past, although how appropriate that was is highly debatable. I recall the sitcom "Soap" getting mileage out of the married character Burt being replaced by an alien who was constantly having sex with Mary, Burt's wife, to the point where the following pregnancy plotline questioned whether the baby was the alien's or Burt's. The premise was supremely silly, and was played that way. They took the impossible nature of the crime as an excuse to mine jokes out of it. (Still, even back then there was something off-putting about the whole plotline, considering the show's ability to combine real emotions and drama with zany situations.)
Aside from a shifting of society's tolerance that has taken place since the days of "Soap" (much as with the movie "Arthur" and the 'cuteness' of drunk driving), I think the Spider-man bit runs into trouble by virtue of the fact that the universe it inhabits doesn't allow the reader to write off the seriousness of the act based on the impossible nature of it. In too many other instances, superhero stories need you to get worked up over unbelievable circumstances. It's hard to tell your audience to buy into the danger of giant robot sentinels hunting down mutants, but to then not take the absurd premise of a shape-shifting super spy impersonating a character too seriously.
Further, I believe it is no longer hard to imagine a real-world scenario where someone could adequately impersonate another. Back in the 70's, the concept was definitely too absurd to take seriously. That's not true today... With the internet, many of us form strong, friendly relationships with people we've never met face to face. It's not impossible to imagine a situation where a hacker or other opportunist could arrange a meeting with someone you know only from online and pass him/herself off as you, possibly victimizing your friend for money, sex or worse. We're warned constantly that we need to be aware that the people we're interacting with may not be what they claim to be... they might not even be the same size, age, or gender as who we assume them to be. As a result, shape-shifting predators aren't nearly as silly of an idea as they used to be, and far fewer people are likely to find the humor in such a set-up.
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Visionary
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Subject: Re: There really is only ONE rule... [Re: Anime Jason] Posted Wed Sep 16, 2009 at 12:48:17 pm EDT (Viewed 7 times) |
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Posted with Mozilla Firefox 3.0.14 on Windows XP
> The ultimate irony, though, is that, in the context of Women In Refrigerators, this all took place in a kitchen.
Indeed... Hadn't caught that.
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Nats
Member Since: Thu Jan 01, 2004 Posts: 85
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Subject: No link to Mightygodking's legal response? [Re: CrazySugarFreakBoy!] Posted Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 10:53:45 pm EDT (Viewed 470 times) |
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Posted with Mozilla Firefox 3.0.12 on Windows XP
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CrazySugarFreakBoy!
Member Since: Sun Jan 04, 2004 Posts: 1,235
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Subject: Adding to my LJ posts now, thanks. [Re: Nats] Posted Fri Sep 18, 2009 at 01:05:39 am EDT (Viewed 453 times) |
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Posted with Microsoft Internet Explorer 7 4.0; on Windows Vista
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